Goodmorning Dan,
I would just like to say this update is unfortunate, but I’m here to stay coming from a Marines Corps Vet and current aviation maintenance technician student I’ve got faith man keep working hard!! Semper Fi !!!
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life is like waiting to die, but no one wants that to come sooner. i am fine with the delay, but the fact that it has to be delayed for another 6-8 months means you guys knew for a while now and just started telling us this now. i just don’t understand why you can let people know a little sooner.
a little bit of transparency goes a long way.
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This is the second time I’ve seen a reference to Pro laser and air extraction problems. I’m guessing both were your posts? I’ve read every single post on the forum and do not recall any specific issues with Pro hardware. Some discussion that the S/W for pass through would be completed after Basic S/W. Could you elaborate or point us to where Dan said anything like this. Thinking it was a misunderstanding.
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It was in his update which I read about 2 days ago, showing the standard letter he had sent out to beta testers…
This new delay, by over 1/2 a year AGAIN is beyond upsetting. The email received this morning basically says “oh we’re delaying again but we won’t tell you exactly why.”
“I realized we had a problem.”
How about a bit of transparency and actually telling your customers what the problem is, and why the lack of quality?
You keep dangling the carrot in front of your backers, and every time it’s the same story: we have a problem with , but we will give you a few incentives (warranty, materials, etc.) while you wait another 3-6 months, at which point we still don’t guarantee that the GF will ship on time.
How many more of these delays will happen, how many more emails will we receive, and at which point will the next email be "sorry, but we have run out of money and won’t be able to ship any units to any of the backers because we’ve run out of money and our investors backed out because we weren’t able to deliver"? Then what happens to the money everyone paid?
While I am not pulling my support yet, I am beyond disappointed in the constant broken promises. I plan to use the duration of the current delay to research other options. If there is another delay after this one, I’m withdrawing my support. At that point, I will pay more for something that already exists and that has a proven track record, rather than wait for something that may never materialize.
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It would be uncharacteristic of me to miss that type of statement. Of course it’s still possible. I just went through all 216 posts of the pre-release letter and every post of Dan’s since Nov 22. Couldn’t find anything discussing those Pro issues. Is it this topic?
Edit: Or maybe you are just saying that the Pro and Filter aren’t ready for pre-release. If that is so the wording of your question misled me.
Edit2: I give up. Can’t find any such reference.
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If I ordered a pro with filter and I live in Hawaii, when will I get my glowforge? Is Hawaii considered international in your scenarios? How many beta units and pre-production units have been deployed and are any of them pros? I ordered my basic + air filter on 2 October 2015 and upgraded to a pro on 14 October 2015, so which date counts?
Dan, in all this negativity I wanted to say you’re doing the right thing. I work in an environment where I get managers and leads trying to push schedule on parts and products knowing full well that there are issues. It’s important to strike the delicate balance between delivering and maintaining the quality that is the company’s reputation. And towards everyone’s requests for proof, Glowforge have frequently shown what their product can do. The images from your post and in Adam Savages video (nice touch by the way to get the original laser boy) prove that you have a product that can make things nothing else can; and far easier than anything else. I was blown away watching that Tested video, which released before you made your announcement, and was amazed you would be shipping in Dec. But after the sad email this morning I am not at all surprised that your are not going to meet deadline. As from that video alone I can see you guys have been putting in the hours to make something really great.
My only concern, is you may now have started down the path to creating art. Hearing talk of a removable head for a 3d printer or inkjet frankly scares me. Yes it sounds cool, but is the bed really optimized for creating a 3d print given the shallow depth? Just want to caution trying to add too many features to the point where we do keep getting delivery delays.
My question is have you at this point reached a final design that you are sending to your manufacturer and getting the initial test units? Or are you still added iterations in addition to manufacture-ability changes?
I’d also request you guys upload a weekly/bi-weekly video of making something on a glowforge. Now that you have Tested on board you might consider asking them…? Heck I’d be willing to come down and help shoot a video for you:wink:
As always, keep up the hardwork! The product you guys have is looking amazing.
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@micha.alv It is literally no one’s fault but your own for going into debt for buying a tool. It is also your fault for buying a plane ticket before you even received a shipping date. You cannot fault a company for spending money you do not have.
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@dan Only one question, why have we been lied to over and over again? As a fellow Dan, I’m disappointed that we share the same name. You’ve disrespected me and everyone who has had faith in your company. Save your sorry for when you can fulfill your promise.
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I find the forum structure a little confusing to navigate myself but if you look for a recent post by Dan in which he replicated the letter of invitation to selected beta testers. This gave a lot more detail about what is currently working and what is not on both the basic and pro versions.
@micha.alv, the folks at Glowforge are very good and reasonable people. if you contact them directly through Customer Support they can work with you on the problem. They can’t do anything from the forum though.
Send an email describing the issue to support@glowforge.com .
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@steve2 that letter was a mail-out for the Pre-Release units. Those are all Basic models.
There isn’t anything implied about the status of the Pro units in that letter. He wasn’t going to waste time talking about them there.
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I have a few questions, some of which I know have been raised by others:
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I am unclear on whether the process/release schedule for the Pro is different from the standard GF. Should we expect these to be released at the same time as the standard units? If not, why? When?
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What is the status of the HEPA filters? Are they on the same release schedule? If not, why not, and when can we expect them?
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Are there factors beyond Glowforge’s control that could still interfere with release – certifications, etc.?
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It seems to me that I’ve read for a number of months that the factory was producing “hundreds” of Glowforges per month in advance of a full production run. Do I have that right? If so, where are those units going? It seems like pre-release units are only now starting to appear in the wild.
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What kind of defects are you seeing with units that led to the conclusion described in yesterday’s email?
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I’d be curious how many orders were cancelled today, versus how many have been cancelled to date. The website still shows “$27.9 million sold in 30 days” but some quantity of those orders must not be live.
Hardware is hard, and a lot of stuff in the Glowforge design is unusual. The serial delays are disappointing, but not surprising, and they don’t get my ire up. Crowdfunding hardware kind of always goes like this. But I will say that the fact that pre-release units are just now appearing does leave me with the impression that it must have been clear for a while that production units were unlikely to ship in December, which doesn’t bolster my confidence in communications going forward.
Good luck!
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Excellent comment and question! I am just slightly angrier than you and went ahead and requested my refund. In addition to that, and I don’t think this is being harsh, Dan should resign effective immediately. All the openness and explanations now seem an effective ploy to string us all along.
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This is the same situation I am in. Thanks to exchange rates… cancelling will cost me several hundred dollars. And the extended warranty and materials I’ll never reorder, and don’t really want worth what… $150, are not going to make up for the thousands I’ve lost by not producing anything.
I
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That actually makes sense. Any other company that screws up this bad typically has the CEO resign pretty much immediately.
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good questions. im hoping he answers these
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Long story made short: I continue to back Glowforge !
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I sent thousands of dollars in October 2015. @dan an has held it and invested it, much like a bank or investor would. So far, in return, I have received … a book. This is not return on the investment. Gift Certs for GF files and samples of materials are not returns on this investment, they’re coupons. Plus we won’t see them until almost two years after our investment.
A refund, at this point, is a loss. That money would earn 1.5-6% simply sitting in a liquid account. Moreover, we were planning to use this thing. Multiple times. Often for social-good programs.
Here’s a very simple Time-Value-of-Money calculator: http://www.grunderware.com/
So at the lowest end, on $2100, we’d have earned $60-260, or we’d have been able to spend those dollars, and not have planned pilot programs around the device.
My question:
What refund or fiscal discount can you offer for these delays? Not gift certs or eventual materials we may not use. And can we have those NOW?
If not, how much EXTRA are you going to refund if we cancel?
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