Discussion of Feb 2021 Update

[randy.cohen]

I don’t understand the concern about licensing images of your project. GF isn’t demanding the source files as a condition to you sharing your project. They want pictures to use to show other users why those other users should buy a GF. They want permission to do whatever they want with those pictures, as a means of effectively leveraging the images for their marketing efforts.

Could someone reproduce your idea from the pictures? Could GF? Sure. Especially if you post orthogonal views that are easily traced. You can make it a lot harder by taking “artful” shots that introduce perspective that’d confound simple tracing. But even if you don’t, it won’t be your artwork, it’ll be their attempt to duplicate your idea. You’re no more exposed than if you posted to this forum, or started marketing your product. Anyone could see (or even buy) your product and then duplicate it. What’s the big deal with GF’s proposal? There’s no real downside, and the upside is that you might get people asking you to make your idea for them.

[roy]

@chris1

Here’s an article about why these kinds of licensing agreements are necessary

I’m a software developer. I fully understand this. I’ve dealt with this on the other side and I’ve always been careful to respect creators’ rights. In one of my companies, we had one creator object to a term in the license agreement. We ended up changing that term in the contract for everyone.

I said I over emphasized the irrevocability. The key thing is that they are insisting on the right to make any changes they want and they are not promising that they will respect and indicate your copyright or attribute your images to you.

@chris1

a few explicitly state “we do not own your content”

This should always be the case. These statements by Glowforge certainly imply otherwise: “…to publish the Creator’s Work(s) (in whole or in part)…” and We may use the Creator’s Work(s) for commercial purposes which may include modifications to the original work(s). (emphasis mine). These are not usual clauses.

@randy.cohen

They want pictures to use to show other users why those other users should buy a GF.

And that sounds great. I was totally willing to do that.

@randy.cohen

They want permission to do whatever they want with those pictures, as a means of effectively leveraging the images for their marketing efforts.

I don’t see how they need the right to modify pictures arbitrarily, or the right to not indicate your copyright or attribute the photos and work properly. When somebody takes your copyrighted work (the images) and presents it without a copyright, it weakens your copyright, especially if you gave them permission to do so.

Now maybe it’s Glowforge’s intent all along to attribute and list copyrights. Maybe they wouldn’t even consider a non-trivial modification. This is why I referred to possibly overzealous lawyers. This is really easy to fix. They just have to say it.

For example “… right and license to use the Creator’s Work(s) with attribution and copyright …” and “…which may be cropped, resized, rotated or color corrected …”

[randy.cohen]

If you’re concerned about copyright for a photograph of something you’ve made, don’t give it to GF. I have no intention of attempting to monetize the stuff I do, so it doesn’t matter.

But I think GF would be smart to offer some kind of licensing deal as motivation to contribute. Otherwise, I do sort of have to wonder what would be the point of helping them out. But, gimme a 24 hour (spread out however I want to use it) access to the premium service and I’d be more than motivated, as would, I suspect, plenty of other GF owners…

If your problem is with giving them something for nothing, that’d address it?

[roy]

@randy.cohen

If your problem is with giving them something for nothing, that’d address it?

Personally, I don’t care about compensation. I want attribution and I don’t want them to damage my copyright (and surely their lawyers understand this). And, I don’t like the idea of anybody modifying my work or my own photographs of my work in any way they want to, without any recourse on my part.

I’m going to try not to respond further. I don’t think Glowforge cares what I think. They’re the big dog and I’m just one person. But I don’t think it’s cool.

[tulipane]

Good to know about that. I had the same issue with a few of the maple pieces I just got as well. I’m glad you “complained” on here. I guess people that don’t like your post should just scroll on past it. Thanks for the response Dan.

[mmullen501]

2020!! NO, can’t do that AGAIN!