Concerns about warranty and non-proofgrade materials

Note that is says Damages

As long as there is no damage, it does not effect the warranty.

ooh, it’s a slightly different warning message on the basic than on the pro. Basic’s don’t have to worry about class 4 conditions or LSOs

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Any damage to the Glowforge can now be attributed to materials with which they advertised but are not technically approved. I think many people would have balked at a purchase of this device, given the currently available approved materials vs. those used in advertising.

So if I use a non-Proofgrade material today, and then 3 months later I experience a problem unrelated to the unapproved material, it seems they have the ability to deny my support request.

I’m not saying this is malicious intent or that they would even deny a support request. I am pointing out that it was sold using materials that can technically void the warranty.

Huh?

How could one expect a company to cover damage caused by stupidity?! How can one possibly hold them responsible for products that other people make?!

If you stick an gasoline can in there to engrave and it blows up, would you think it’s Glowforge’s fault/responsibility?!

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Stop calling me stupid, I’m pointing out that they advertised several materials being cut that are not approved. I feel mislead.

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This was a strip of leather, not a gas rag.

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What in the…? So, what… you just read things and then make up what they actually say? Okay. I’m out. Best of luck to you.

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Jeez man, be careful how you word things. You about gave me an aneurism!

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The verbiage in the warning is saying that if you use Proofgrade there is nothing to worry about as they ‘control’ the power and the ‘speed’. If there are any issues with the material or the machine while using their material (Proofgrade) it’s under warranty. If you use something other then proofgrade and something happens to the material (as in this case you will have to research to find out if the material is laser safe and find what power and speeds to get the results you want on your own) or the machine in the results of using 3rd party material- then that is not under warranty. There is obvious wiggle room in that, i.e. you happen to have a 3rd party material and the machine does nothing or attempts to lase and nothing happens. But the damage happens in the result of using the 3rd party material, then you are on your own.

With that all being said. Just be smart and safe and just double check to see if what you are using can be lasered and will not emit toxic fumes that would harm more importantly you then also the machine.

If you are using (i.e. in your case leather) in the materials list you can use the settings for the Proofgrade leather as a starting point. Just make a test pattern and adjust until you get the desired result.

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I think you are free to interpret it as you want.

However, as I see it, no other manufacturers actually warranty the machine from the result of ANY damage caused by materials. They maintain a simple free from manufacturer defects warranty.

Could they deny your warranty claim if something happens to your Glowforge, they get it back, and it’s full on covered in/eaten away by corrosion from cutting vinyl? Sure.

Could they deny you if you ran a print on a piece of cardboard, it caught fire and destroyed stuff? Yup.

Could they deny you if you were cutting a piece of proofgrade, it caught fire and destroyed the machine? Nope.

That’s actually a lot more than what others are offering…

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It’s just saying, “Be sure you know what you’re doing.” This restriction would be true of any laser, but other models assume that they’re being used by businesses or risk-aware DIYers.

Epilog’s not going to replace your crumb tray if you use a dense, dark wood that catches fire. FSL’s not going to clean your lenses if you vaporize a bunch of PVC. The only difference is that GF is telling you so in advance.

Chances are, the leather’s fine. But since there’s no encoding on it, GF doesn’t know what it is.

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It really is only the necessity to cover liability. Think of the “Do Not Eat” warning on those little desiccant packets. :roll_eyes:

Understanding the legalese in product warranties can be daunting, bit you are not locked into anything, other than understanding if the material you use is not Proofgrade and it’s use results in damage to the machine it’s not covered under warranty.
The whole idea of Proofgrade was to supply a proven, consistent material that the user doesn’t have to worry about looking up MSD (material safety data) sheets on, or explore settings for to experience a desired result.

For inexperienced users (like me) that are part of their target market, Proofgrade contributes to the ease of use design.

So now you can stop worrying about that and start enjoying your glowforge! :crazy_face:

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Legal parsing aside, I understand how warranties work and that Glowforge needs to protect themselves. The main point I was making is that the machine was advertised to cut materials that are not “safe” to use without risk of damaging the machine or voiding the warranty.

In the example of trying to cut on leather, the warning states that you could be releasing toxic fumes. It says if you’re unsure to consult with an expert. Regardless of possible warranty issues, I would like to stay safe while using the Glowforge. Is there someone at Glowforge that handles these requests to act as an expert?

At the very least, it would be nice to have a list of materials that have the Glowforge staff has extensively tested and to not pose a danger to yourself or the machine. Of course, Glowforge can’t test every material out there.

I’m not trying to be alarmist or start a flame war. I’d like some clarification on the materials I can use safely in the Glowforge. Bottom line is that I cannot print on materials that were in the promo video without risking damage or warranty voidance, according to the dialog box that pops up.

I would like more clarification on this issue from Glowforge themselves. I just want to be able to make cool stuff with materials as advertised, without risking damage to my machine or myself.

P.S. If I’m not mistaken I cannot print several things in the promo video without this risk.

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I’m reminded of this scene from The Simpsons…

The cult is just giving a friendly reminder that participants are free to do what they want. And the motives behind the way the message is presented are clear.

Source web page, in case the video doesn’t work in the forum…
http://www.simpsonsworld.com/video/312303683786

NO IT WASN’T!

Name ONE unsafe material they used. Just ONE will be absolutely fine to prove your point.

Safety information on materials is public. As they’ve stated, it’s your responsibility to check with an expert. Google will help you with that.

Then why are you trying to change what is actually stated, to something that is not stated?!

That list is at shop.glowforge.com. Anything in there has gone through said testing.

Again, that box DOES NOT SAY THAT.

You are.

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As has been said you are free to interpret the manuals, warnings and intent as you wish. Your issue has been answered with what is normal practice in the laser industry. The only difference is that GF has gone a step further to provide materials that are guaranteed to be laser safe. They are also warning people who have no experience with lasers that using other materials have risks. They have risks in every laser made. The lawyers are simply not willing to put in writing what is and what is not safe beyond the Proofgrade. You can find this info through a simple Google search and asking folks in this forum.

That said, your concerns are valid since you are laser inexperienced but the title seems to be inaccurate and inflammatory. So you should expect push back.

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I see they have come up with a new warning splash. I hadn’t seen it yet.

It’s very pretty.

It’s a warning to proceed at your own risk. So proceed at your own risk.

There are a lot of the customer base that have never used a laser before, and haven’t bothered to do any research on what is and isn’t safe to use in the laser. It’s just a reminder to do some research. (As good a way as any to get the message out as any I guess.)

If you are cutting leather, you probably want to check to make sure it was vegetable tanned, and that it is real leather, and not pleather, which looks like leather, but actually can contain vinyl. Vinyl is not always safe to cut with a laser. It can create a corrosive gas that will EAT the machine.

The Beyond the Manual section of the forum is where we discuss things that we cut that are not Proofgrade. You can ask there if you have a material that is not Glowforge supplied, and a lot of people who cut other things will be happy to help and offer suggestions. But you will be doing it at your own risk. Damage to the machine by cutting something that is going to corrode it is not going to be a warranty covered replacement.

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I’m sorry if the warning caused any confusion.

Using non-Proofgrade materials does not void your warranty, but if there is a problem with your materials that damages your Glowforge, the damage caused by your materials would not be covered under the warranty.

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