Today, I discovered something rather distasteful and unpleasant on this discussion site. Namely, it is the presence of shills and suck-ups. By this, I mean people who are either sycophantically loyal, or possibly trolling for GF. I made a simple comment about wanting to do some simple engraving on metal and within minutes two people jumped on my comment, touting the GF line and trying to shut down further discussion of the topic. Had the âdiscussionâ that this forum is suppose support gone on, I would have provided additional detail on my special needs, the desire to use GF for different sorts of metals (in a way that GF already claims it can perform), and my desire to use other materials. Instead, I get rapid-response (within 3-6 minutes) beat-downs of my comment AND I find that I am locked out of any option to reply back.
TO THE GF ORGANIZERS OF THIS DISCUSSION SITE: This sort of muzzling looks VERY slimey and intentionalâŚespecially on the heels of yesterdayâs delivery delay announcement. It does not leave me feeling as good about this product. If youâre going to muzzle anyone, muzzle the butt kissers, shills, and sycophants that are infesting this community!
Iâm not sure what you are looking for however, everyone is trying to help everyone so sometimes you get eerily fast responses. So far everything Iâve seen and read The laser is not powerful enough to cut, engrave, tarnish any metal surface. If there is some sort of coating on it that can be removed the metal however no go.
Also I have absolutely no experience with metal work, however there are number of people who do and all links back to ceremark etc⌠you can reply on their comment they left for you further down, you canât reply to the comment directly off of your comment though that is a weird quirk.
I want an open and honest discussion. One in which unpopular views are discussed as much as the popular ones. So, the answer to the first part of your question is ânoâ. I want robust debate. The answer to the second part of your question is âyesâ. You should ALWAYS be able to reply to any comment, especially one that is made on something you write. To be given only the choices of âabandoning the postâ, or âkeeping the postâ without a 3rd choice of commenting is more than a bit Orwellian.
It sounds like youâre trying to âcomment on your commentâ, which may not be a feature of the Discourse software itself (which Glowforge uses). Glowforge didnât write the forum software⌠but itâs not some attempt to censor, I guarantee you that.
In regards to your attempts to cut any untreated metal with a Glowforge, it just cannot be done. The GF lacks the power output to do it.
You can, however, remove painted material applied to metal without harm. And through using Ceremark or the like, you can âbakeâ paint onto the metal, again without harm to the metal itself.
Sorry, I donât understand how you are unable to commentâŚ
I reread the thread you reference, and I didnât see any disrespectful comments, just the regulars here offering their understanding of your question, nobody trying to shut you down.
(Just my perception.)
There have been several people who wanted to engrave metals, but didnât understand that it was only possible to mark them chemically.
There are several references to the procedure in the FAQâs.
The forum is populated with many skilled, experienced laser users, and is a great source for information.
Your experience added to the total here would be most welcome.
Hi @sdevadas, I donât think people meant to come off as they did. They wanted to warn you about the limitations of any CO2 laser. From the description of what you want to do, it sounds like it may not be possible with a 40-45W CO2 laser.
The problem as I understand it (anyone please correct me if I am wrong) is that metals are reflective at the wavelength the CO2 lasers run at, so you need to put in a lot of power to get minimal effect. And this is not a Glowforge issue. Any CO2 laser at similar power levels will have this same issue.
From looking at the previous thread, it looks like you want to 3D engrave a piece of metal then fill it with acrylic (which honestly sounds like it would be pretty awesome). Unfortunately, a CO2 laser may not be your best bet. I would recommend looking at a milling machine.
Shills, sycophants and trolls.
People on this site seem to have tried to offer you good solid advice.
Why not listen to to them? They might save you a lot of money on a product you clearly havenât researched.
Get a refund, this wonât do what you want it to.
Thanks for attempting to explain this, Dan. Still, it is a huge integrity liability that GF needs to address and for which there is no real excuse. Even the very fact that you are able to come back at me now with a comment, whereas I couldnât even reply to yours is suspect. While I appreciate your assurance, it is not enough. If weâre going to discuss serious issues, then it is the imperative of GF to make sure the site functions properly ALL the time.
Some of these comments and replies are critical to the businesses of individuals like me. Frankly, my concerns are in a bit of a different league than many of the hobbyists that are here.
Thank you for your clarification on the materials, but its a bit more involved than the simple parameters being laid out here. I have dozens of different paths I can take, in terms of material and approach. Youâre not understanding what I mean by acrylic fill and I donât really have time to explain it. While what you say about the materials is true, it does not comprehend the situation.
I regret that you feel disrespected by the discussion on this forum. I agree, at times many of the comments on other posts are less than thoughtful or respectful of the point of view expressed by the original poster. People often include references to the character of the poster rather than to the actual meaning of the post. I find myself tempted to make judgments about the person rather than the post. To me it seems that @jacobturnerâs response to your post was pretty good, although it was a leading question and would be disallowed in court. @dan_berryâs response was a little curt, and since it used the word âshouldâ and was blunt, certainly could be perceived as condescending and non-productive. Iâll respond to your original post in that thread.
As to this: [quote=âsdevadas, post:1, topic:1956â]
Namely, it is the presence of shills and suck-ups.
[/quote]
I have yet to perceive a post that represents a shill. I would love to have more Glowforge employees post about their experience but understand the reasons why they arenât. @dan certainly has been making a hard sell for the product. That makes sense. I donât know if the original VC backers are on this forum posting without our knowing who they are, that may be. It seems that the cheerleaders for the Glowforge to me are just random folks who are genuinely excited about the product and what they can make with it.They seem to me to be a pretty positive bunch that really do spin everything in the best light. I canât imagine that Glowforge would even need to use shills to promote the product on the forum. But then, I may have missed something in here. I try to read all the profiles of new forum participants to get a sense of who they are, but sometimes the details are very sparse.
As to sycophants, I can imagine that my posts would be perceived as sucking up. Itâs a label I have born most of my life, although in high school it wasnât quite as elegant a name. They called me âbrown noserâ and sang the BTO song, âHe looked at me with his big brown nose and said, âYou ainât seen nothing yet.ââ Iâve often thought that it stems from my being the fifth boy and having to try so hard to get noticed by my four older brothers. And yes, sometimes the forum regulars can dog pile on a comment and be less than inviting. There have been a few topics that seemed to devolve into âpro-Glowforgeâ versus âanti-Glowforgeâ and not about the merits of the actual topic.
As to this point:
Are you referring to how Discourse works? I am not quite sure. I can click on any comment and reply specifically to that. Yes, all comments appear in a line, one after the other, but you can also see the thread as it develops from comment, to reply, to reply to comment on reply by clicking the grey text at the bottom left of original comment that has something like â2 Replies ^â and will show the replies to a comment in line right below. Is that what you are referring to?
It seems that you have some experience using lasers and would be very helpful to the common effort. I myself will try to help you as I can.
As a matter of fact, this will not be a hobby machine but an important business tool. Fortunately Iâve had long enough in business to do my research and to plan for contingencies (both talents not enough people invest in).
My business is successful enough that I am considered one of the foremost practitioners in my trade in the country and count government and some of Europes foremost conservation bodies in my client base (indeed they make up the majority of my clients).
I donât and never have worshiped anything (I am a strict anti-theist).
The difference between you and I, is that I planned for this. You, clearly didnât
and I would never dream of laying the blame for my own shortcomings at the feet of others.
Sorry if I misunderstood what you are trying to do. I just wanted to make sure you know the limitations. There have been other people who wanted to exclusively do metal cutting/engraving and didnât realize what the limitations of CO2 laser were. It would suck if you got something that didnât do what you need it to do.
Printo, as I mentioned before its a wider issue. The trigger may have been this thing that Joe mentioned, but the shill-ism issue is much bigger. Take a look at this morningâs comments about the delay and youâll know what I mean.
For the record: I appreciate those folks who honestly want to helpâŚeither technically, or in other aspects. But, I really loathe people who express their support for something in ways that depend upon limiting discussion or suppressing dissent.
I apologize for flagging your response, but I found it extraordinarily condescending. Much in the way you did not wish to be treated. I am sorry. I thought about flagging the whole post, but I donât want to do that, because you should be able to express your concerns.
Not out of any sense of sycophant-ism. Just desire for respectful communication
Okay. I was fine with this post up until it was made âpersonalâ. I flagged it as well. The forum really doesnât need this kind of discussion. Call it censoring if you want, but itâs off-topic at best and insulting at worst.