Yes, been musing about their Mini 18. I think the workflow is one I could live with. A fair bit more $$$, but might be the direction I head if I think I have to walk away from the Glowforge Pro train I’m on. See how things progress over the next while I guess.
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Initial reviews and early user feedback will be interesting to see - on both the GF and Muse.
Now, you are only hearing (limited) feedback from a small handful of users in the Beta and Pre-Production unit people. Shortly there will be the full 15,000 Glowforge units out in the wild and looking for help. One or two people on a help desk will probably find themselves pretty challenged by the masses.
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I would hope that they are spinning up on this as production spins up. No matter how user-friendly you make it there are going to be issues on this size of sales.
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Yes. but I was thinking more of feedback from a few members here that seem to have interests parallel to my own so far as GF is concerned. Muse and FSL are pretty much unknowns to me so getting good feedback on the Muse will be more difficult. That’s likely to keep me in the GF camp longer.
In fact, the more user-friendly you make things, the more of certain kinds of issues there are. 
People have different expectations from things that are billed as easy to use.
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Indeed, I’m not worried about those of us that are here all the time. More worried about the hundreds that have never created an account for the forum. I hope for everyone’s sake that there are plenty of staff to help those that will need some hand holding.
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I did the “send info” button on the Muse because they don’t publish the pricing. The email I got back was specifically targeting how it was much better than the GF and where they disagreed with the GF design. I never mentioned GF in the request that the “send info” button created. I’m amazed they’re focused almost exclusively on the GF. When I went to marketing school it was always “never mention the competition because it only validates them”. I think the FSL email had more instances of “Glowforge” than “Muse” (and the grammar and spelling was not 100% correct - that drives me nuts!).
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More than anything, price has been the factor keeping me on the GF train from the get go. I had no thought of receiving my Glowforge for a good year when I bought in on October 2, 2015. The latest push down the road 7 more months and the prospect of that reality continuing has gotten me off my lazy butt to get out and re-evaluate some of the quality alternatives. I think I’m pretty close to being able to rationalize jumping ship and investing in the Epilog Mini 18 - 40 watt unit with the rotary attachment. Double the cost of my GF Pro, but only a 3 week lead time (which at this point is a “feature” that is creeping up the list at light speed).
It’s funny how you evaluate features and other product considerations, and how some of them can migrate to more prominent positions in the equation with the passage of time. As I desensitize myself to the price differential of the competitive products of quality, other features can become rationalization points for considerations you were softer on earlier in the evaluation process. As I look back, yes I’m liking the thought of 4" of Z height. I’m liking the thought of the rotary tool. Certainly liking the 20+ year track record. But now, having been handed the opportunity to reassess, my biggest like of what I am looking at is that it is a non cloud based solution. I know that the cloud is the place to be and I’m totally old school on that technology view, but I just like having one less thing to be dependent upon.
As most will know of me, I’m not know as the defender of the faith or one of the cool kids from the KoolAid crowd, I’m just a nuts and bolts pragmatist. The companies that make my toys hold no special place in my heart other than for the fact they make good gear. I think that Glowforge may well be one of those companies in time, but at this point, I fear I may well be only experiencing that from the sidelines.
I’ve found it a hard couple of weeks going back and forth on all this and I’m still not sure where I will land at the end of the day. . .
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For what it’s worth I hope you stick with it. I always enjoy your posts, even the ones I disagreed with on occasion 
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However, Epilog makes a nice tool! It really depends on what your looking for and what you’re willing to pay. Personally, I wouldn’t let the cloud be the deciding factor. But, if Z height and rotary are important, I would say go for the epilog.
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Hmm - I signed up for Muse info early on, but never got that email comparing the Muse to GF. The last one I got was the newsletter from mid-November which talked about Muse features.
I’m one of those that read the Sep/Oct 2015 GF literature as literally claiming that product would start shipping in December, though I also figured it would be a few months later before I saw mine. The most recent delay has gotten me looking at alternatives too, but this is a hobby so time isn’t as much of a concern as it is for those that are missing out on profits or have time-sensitive projects.
You make some interesting observations on cost sensitivity. Over the years, I’ve found that spending more for a quality product was seldom a waste of money so long as the product was actually needed and used often. If you expect to be making money with the laser it should be a pretty simple calculation to determine the cost of waiting for the GF. Accounting for the benefits of the increased Z range and the rotary attachment might be a little trickier unless you already have plans along those lines.
I’m greatly encouraged to see @karaelena getting the next pre-release model because I think that he’ll be trying the sorts things that I have in mind and he has quite a bit of relevant experience. I’ll be waiting to see how his GF works out before seriously exploring alternatives.
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Did you get a price for the Muse and is it available now, or just a pipe dream like GF?
3 options for purchase, shipping for lower 48 included in price.
- Muse + Water Chiller $5,500
- Muse + Small Fume Extractor $6,000
- Muse + Small Fume Extractor + Water Chiller $6,500’’
No real info on whether the chiller & extractor are required (if so, they ought to be in the base price & not an add-on) or if they’re upgrades to whatever comes as the basic unit (e.g. basic has a water pump but you can get a chiller for the extra $500). They claim to be shipping next month (Jan 2017).
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They only send it if you go to their Muse page now and hit the button to buy one - then they collect your email and send you a long rambling email that has the GF comparison and the pricing info.
That’s what makes our countries such wonderful places, we are allowed to disagree with each other and articulate it and to that end, It’s been a pleasure having you disagree with me from time to time. But I’ve moved on, and not being one of the KoolAid crowd I suspect my “access” to the forum will be shut down PDQ. New path; Epilog Mini 18"X12" - 40 watt with rotary attachment. The Glowforge would have been great fun, but my Epi will be here in 3 - 4 weeks and I expect it will be great fun too!
There are no right or wrong choices here, just different needs and priorities. I my opinion, Glowforge is destined for greatness and I’m sorry I’ll only see it from the sidelines.
Keep the faith baby! 
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Best of luck. That’s a good machine. You’ll love it.
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If you don’t mind me asking, what was the cost? Ballpark? More than the GF Pro?
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Whoa! Awesome man! Congrats. Sorry to see you go, but excited youll have a laser in your possession soon! If you still have access, share some of the stuff youve made!
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With the external air assist pump and the rotary attachment ~ $14,300 Cdn. (~ $10,400 U.S. at current exchange rates). More for sure, but again, there are no bad choices in this tier, just different choices. Wish I could have gone the distance.
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