This machine is so much fun! We are basically inexperienced makers, so half of the stuff that y’all say goes directly over our heads, but we REALLY appreciate your experience and knowledge in ways that we can’t even express. We have barely scratched the surface in the two weeks that we have had this machine. There are so many things that we still want to try. Things may still be in beta, and improving all the time…but frankly we’re inexperienced enough to not know the difference. 
I just have to say that This. Machine. Is. Awesome!!! THANKS, Dan and team! 
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That’s just what GF was hoping for I think.
There’s a lot of sniping and trash talk by people who have piles of experience and are missing the point. The GF really is all about ease of use.
Some of us who use other machines regularly envy newbies somewhat because although you love what you’ve got, you can’t appreciate how much better it is than what has preceded it 
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I was jabbering on the other day about how I wish I had gotten a laser cutter so much sooner. And then I realized that if I had, I probably would have hated it. The reason I got excited and bought a glowforge is pretty much the same reason I never considered buying a laser cutter before.
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Most of our work has been with a CNC machine but we’ve spent some time with a Chinese laser at a local maker space. Our eyes got pretty big when we realized how many steps got skipped in comparison when using the glowforge. Can only imagine what it must be like for you experienced makers! Ultimately, it’s good for all of us! Should have said it in my first post, but I’m super thankful for all of the beta users and contributors to “The Matrix” and all of the forum posts. It’s a remarkable community.
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Might be why I’m so delighted with it. I didn’t know what using a laser entailed, but when I started testing the PRU, I was tickled to death to find that it didn’t require the tedious testing and specifying settings for every operation that I was expecting.
With any new machine, there are actually three learning curves. One is learning to design for it, and that one you can’t get around. It can take a while if you’re unfamiliar with design, but what I like about this one is, you can do the designing on whatever software you are already comfortable with, so it’s a lot shorter. 
The second is learning your materials. Each one has characteristics that you have to learn to work around. The Proofgrade materials don’t completely eliminate the need to learn a little bit about the differences in lasering wood and acrylic, but they come just about as close as you can. I don’t think most people realize how much having those settings predetermined for us are saving us, time-wise.
The third learning curve is learning to operate the machine/ use the interface/ make it do what you want it to do. And for this machine, that is also very easy. It’s a simple interface, there are very few rules to learn, and it’s got a lot of bells and whistles to make object placement easier. It’s not perfect, it’s never going to do everything that everyone wants it to do, but it’s improving all the time, and I’m enjoying watching it get better and better.
Anytime I can get going strong with a machine after less than a week, I consider that a tremendously well thought out and well designed machine. This one only took a couple of days.
I think @dan had the right word for it…that’s magical. 
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There is a lot of sniping and trash talk though because Glowforge has promised much more than they have delivered and a lot of people are too inexperienced to know the difference 
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Maybe. But a lot of us understand the concept of Beta and have patience (easier to say when you’re in the US and have a machine though).
Sometimes those folks who are so much smarter than the rest of us could just give it a rest.
That’s terribly unfair to say, everybody had a lot of patience waiting multiple years for a laser that was supposed to be delivered in 3 months.
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Agreed. But we’ve spent 2 years bemoaning the lack of delivery on the original time frame. We’ve spent the last year with certain people beating the drum of failure because of missing software or perceived faults in the design of the machine.
No one here is unaware that it was supposed to have been delivered 2 years ago. Nor should anyone (if they read the forum or the agreement they assent to when taking delivery) be surprised that there are features that are not yet done.
Pretty sure that 2 years of pointing out on a near daily occurrence that GF is late and that they haven’t delivered everything they promised counts as saying it to death. It’s not a reflection of ignorance or inexperience not to need to continue to rehash the past two years. (Not suggesting it’s you by the way, you’ve been far more helpful and patient than many especially considering you’re an international buyer and have no real details available to you beyond a pretty fluid “personalized” date.)
Didn’t mean to start World War 3 or to get into a debate about experienced verses inexperienced users or whether or not the wait was grueling, (which it was). I just wanted to say that I like my machine, because I really, really do. A lot.
#peaceloveandmisunderstanding
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Me too 
I do little with the other 2 lasers now. Just easier to go to the GF.
It’s like when we built our house. Was supposed to be done in 3 months. It wasn’t. Or 4 or 5 or 6…But when it was finally done we were thrilled but decided we’d never build again. But we’ve found time makes some memories hazy & we’re thinking of doing it again
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I built two houses. It will be just as bad the second time, LOL. But you’ll still love the outcome.
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The trouble is that nobody has actually been delivered the laser cutter that they paid for, not one single customer. Whats more worrying is that any day now GF could turn around and say they’re actually unable to deliver all the things they promised and they’ll be no comeback for any customer.
If anyone had bought any other laser 2 years ago, they would now be ‘expert’ users and find all the things they’re currently doing on the GF easy. In certain aspects I believe most other lasers are actually easier to use (rescaling an item for example)
I don’t think it’s wrong to bemoan those issues, especially with the poor communication thrown in.
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If someone feels that way, they should decline the delivery until after the filter and the software is all pronounced “done”. They’ll retain their ability to get a refund and still have the potential to get the machine they were promised. Those of us who already got ours took that as a calculated risk when accepting our delivery.
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And for features they are unable to deliver? That’s a hell of a kicker to wait this long and have GF not deliver the ability to cut from both sides of the material for example. There was no indication in the funding period that they weren’t able to correctly align the camera to the cuts for another example, the machines were sold with those features.
The ‘refund anytime you like’ argument is just dumb, it’s not a recourse.
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My point is that people have a right to be upset, you may have settled for what GF have opted to deliver and you may not miss the things that they don’t deliver but that’s because we live in a post truth era. You can’t begrudge people for being upset about it.
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You’re right. And I’ll be bummed but I won’t be stabbing myself in the heart because they failed.
We all went on a crowdsourced journey together. Whether we had all the info available at the time, or whether we’d do it again if we had known what was to come or whether we’re going to get what we paid for is all pretty irrelevant to the experience of owning one for their target market. It is what it is. We have two options - take what we’re offered or get our money back.
It’s not to say GF didn’t make many mistakes or has failed their customers in many ways, but in your words, continuing to complain is just dumb. It’s not going to change history and we have the ability to walk away - maybe with something that makes us happy or maybe with only our money.
No one is suggesting they don’t. Just asking that their 400th post whining about the delay or the latest fail is their last one on the subject.
I’m not going to rain on anyone’s parade when they’re honestly thrilled with what they’ve received. It’s a well crafted and generally robust unit that’s well supported (even if it’s in large part due to the forum) and coming from other lasers where that’s not been the case, I’m pretty happy too.
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We certainly can begrudge people who:
- rain on someone else’s parade
And - are tedious about it
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The people who are upset have a right to be upset and they can continue to complain about it for as long as they want to. You don’t have to read those posts.
What’s tedious is the number of people trying to shut them down with the refund argument, instead of getting sensible replies from GF about when their issues are going to be resolved (if ever).
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They can but the latter isn’t the case. It’s hard to not read something buried in a thread about something else.
And if it’s okay for people to keep complaining, then it’s okay for people to keep pointing out they can get a refund 
Tedious swings both ways. 
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