Why? Your frustration has been noted. Your frustration is absolutely warranted. We all get it. Does beating this horse to death over and over really help? Is there something forum members can do here? Is there something GF can do at this point? (That answer is yes, refund you. So you can order a Dremel. I’m only a little bit curious as to why you haven’t done that yet.) NO, GF cannot ship your unit yet, for whatever reason. Doesn’t REALLY matter as to why at this point, if it showed up on your doorstep tomorrow, you wouldn’t be happy, you’d say, “FINALLY!” and save all of this “recap” for the next complaint thread when you run into even a simple problem (that will also be a well documented issue no doubt). The letter was funny. But we all apparently missed the true intent.
Seriously. Contact support. Get your money back. There is clearly nothing you can create with the GF that will make-up for your personal level of frustration. Order a Dremel. Please. I guarantee you’ll be happier. (Or a Muse, or any other machine that you can get right away. I can point you in the right direction for some forums with tons of recommendations and user support. No lie.)
Be quiet or get a refund is at the core be quiet here or be quiet somewhere else. It’s an answer that missing, they could tell us what is going on and there’s nothing to be loud about. It’s fact and I can make a decision with that.
I understand this is uncomfortable but GF kills another horse every time they miss a deadline. Tell us why it died and what you’re doing about it, we hit it with a stick to draw attention to it.
No one here believes that for a second. If they explained each and every minute detail of each and every minute (and major) set-back, the arm-chair CEOs would be loud and proud with all of their solutions.
Why you think GF isn’t paying attention to the horse(s) is beyond me. Why people think they just don’t want to deliver every unit as soon as possible makes zero sense. They aren’t doing enough for you and your money. Totally understood. Yet, you let them keep it. The level of frustration is absolutely understandable. Choosing to remain at that level, with a company you clearly distrust, makes no sense.
Well one thing’s for sure, @public2 did a nice job on the letter to his $4070. It’s fair to say that probably the vast majority of backers are unhappy with GF’s level of service and repeated broken promises. But at the same time, I will say that for me it was worth the wait even if I didn’t get the promised discount. Sincere good luck to you international backers that are choosing to hang in there; also, thumbs up and “good choice” to you backers who are requesting refunds.
I won’t – indeed, can’t – argue with the logic of that. Canceling would be the rational thing to do.
I kept faith with Glowforge without much hesitation for two years. That was when Dan finally admitted after months of red flags that there were problems with delivering the air filter. He flat refused to answer any questions about it. That attitude – we want your money and support, but when we don’t deliver anything close to what we promised, we don’t owe you an explanation – felt, and still feels, like a giant middle finger raised to me as a “customer”.
If I cancel today, Glowforge gets literally everything they wanted out of me without having to be accountable for delivering anything. My money was a nice prop to show to investors to demonstrate demand, and they got a little profit out of the deal, since that money was held in an interest-bearing account. I get less than nothing; inflation alone means my 2015 dollars are worth $233 less if they hand them back to me in 2018. Being a Glowforge “customer” feels bad. But the idea of walking away with less than zero while Dan strolls to the bank flipping me the bird feels even worse.
The only leverage I have is that I am still owed what I paid for, and I don’t really want to let Dan off that hook.
Does that make sense? No, you’re right: it doesn’t. Is it healthy, or a good way to make decisions? No. But at this stage of my journey as a Glowforge “customer”, the only choice I have is how I am going to lose, and at least as of right now this is the way that feels least disempowering. You can shake your head at that and write me off as a nut, and I can’t really blame you. But I am not just going to shut up and play happy.
Yes, we certainly can’t have Glowforge giving explanations; someone might be critical of them.
I’m afraid that the very large red herring you’ve turned over there quite overpowers the smell of dead horse. The idea, much promoted by Dan, that the only alternative to offering zero information on a two-and-a-half year delay is to provide minutely detailed technical details is ludicrous.
I don’t see any evidence that delivering the filters is a priority at all. They were crowing about the new laser cutter model they released a few weeks ago, but the notice of the latest three month filter delay was given less billing in the latest update than the availability of Proofgrade at the JoAnn Fabrics in Columbus, Ohio.
The hole is pretty deep, but showing a modicum of good faith would be a start. They’d have to lower the middle finger and take some time to build confidence that the delivery estimates are based on something other than a guess as to what customers will tolerate this time around. And if they can cut prices for brand new customers by $1,000 a unit, I think they can refund a few hundred bucks to people whose money they have held for going on three years.
I can’t speak for international customers, who have a different/additional set of frustrations, but that could get me back to a place where I am merely very irritated.
raises hand I knew clearly that selling my previous machine to have a GF made was a tricky situation, but I, a business owner, had backups in place and backups to my backups (which turned out to be necessary since TechShop filed for Bankruptcy literally a week before I received my shipment notice).
However, I was also familiar with manufacturing and walking into my order knowing full well that it could take 3 - 5 years. I understand this is not common among users in the forum, and I have witnessed some terrible things said about this situation. But, you paid for a new machine to be manufactured from the ground up, knowing that the company was located in the US and that said machine did not exist at the time, would need to be created, then manufactured on a larger scale, then shipped, and then go through customs.
It’s been a ride, but know your rollercoaster car is still moving.
Perhaps you should have told Glowforge, because at the time they were representing that they would start shipping by the end of 2015.
Which is convenient, because so am I.
That’s not accurate. Glowforge was showing off units to the public on September 26 and 27, 2015 at World Maker Faire.
I do understand that manufacturing is not easy, but if you want me to front you money for two and a half years longer than you said I would have to, I expect you to explain to me why, and why that is a reasonable bet on my part.
No, I’m not. The rest of the quote is… “If they explained each and every minute detail of each and every minute (and major) set-back, the arm-chair CEOs would be loud and proud with all of their solutions.” Because you know how to build a laser cutting machine and filter and software to run them from the ground up, and get it manufactured for thousands of people in every country. But ya didn’t. Perspective. Get some.
You can disagree, you can claim I lack perspective but you’ve not been following along if you claim no one believes GF should be sharing more information. One of the following had an answer last I checked and it wasn’t great. This doesn’t even include the goodbye posts.
I just today paid $2k for a 3D printer that is supposed to be half price, and I paid $1k more for my Pro so even now I waited 8 mo for when it arrived a year ago I might want to stick with my $600 blue monster if I could get that $1k refund or not have bought it in the first place (not an option). After they extended the wait time by what turned out to be another four months I was elevated to the status of founder but did not get any money back.