Discussion of the September 2017 update (OLD)

Not really, I’m sure it is the maximum they can get away with by law. It stops the ticker on the proofgrade, so if it takes the full 6 weeks, you are out $20.

They could also claim they were "shipping"
during the makerfaire, and allowed them to stay “on schedule” for the Pro delivery.

I could see it if they were doing 2 weeks until it’s delivered to your door, but a month and a half is just, odd.

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Something is set into motion when they send the email; it doesn’t seem to be speculative. So why not look at it in a positive light? Before you get it, you’re in the dark and worried there may be yet another delay. When you get the message, you can start clearing space and preparing projects, because it’s definitely coming in the next 6 weeks. Several of us, myself included, have seen it take more like 2 weeks, so there’s some evidence that the production process is smoothing out.

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Still no update on Canadian shipping?? Wow. Guess ill have to make friends across the border to get a Glowforge this year :stuck_out_tongue:

well, it’s supposedly going to be soon. i’m trying to be hopeful, haha! but yeah, several people have gone across the border now and picked it up via a shipping service.

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It’s probably when you get your production slot, and parts are in inventory, but that’s still a long way from what anyone else would call shipping. I’m not sure why the use of “shipping” in this case seems dishonest or misleading to me, and not others. I’m not as upset about it as it may read. I just think they could use a more appropriate term, or a shorter interval.

I believe Amazon sends shipping notices when product is handed to the carrier.

A shipping notice is better than “I let you down again” I’ll give you that. My space is prepped, and ready to go. I’m not going to bother putting the K40 in the space, because it looks like it will be replaced soon enough.

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It seems like they don’t start building your machine until you agree to accept it. They seem to send out a bunch of emails. The build a batch of machines and dispatch them. I cannot fathom why they don’t just build them first and and then send the emails a day or two before they are ready for dispatch.

For me it can be several months delay because unless I get my email before the end of this month I don’t have a six week period where I will be home until February. If they don’t send all the 30 day emails in the next two weeks then the six week period goes past the end of October.

There should be a way to say yes I want it but don’t dispatch it until date X. I can’t think of any other product that has a six week delivery window. Lots of things like cars take 12 weeks for a factory order but you don’t have to be at home for six weeks to receive it.

It looks like the only option to delay is to wait 30 days before replying, wait for the filter or the software to be out of beta. The only option for me seems to be the latter unless the filters are late. Or more likely OS deliveries wont even start this year so it won’t be a problem.

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I don’t know if this is why, but in the United States the UCC laws governing mail order requires shipment within 30 days or you can cancel and get a refund - unless you’re informed of and accept a longer delivery time. So if they ship and it takes 31 days you can refuse shipment and get your money back. With the GF you had the option to get your money back before you said Yes, ship it, so the extra opportunity to rescind the offer would mean they can’t really take the money they’ve got for you onto their books (accountingwise) until after it’s delivered.

If they figure it’s a worst case 6 weeks then they say that up front and they take the revenue on notice and are not exposed to returns.

This method (wait for response from specific individual, build unit specifically for them) would be a logistical nightmare, and has no rational basis to be generated that I can conceive.

What I picture as being the method used is that they make a projection of how many units will be produced in the next 4 weeks, and send out a large batch of emails to that many people from the list. To account for the possibility of unforeseen delays, you are quoted up to 6 weeks for delivery.

There is no waiting for people to respond to emails, production is ongoing at all times. It is reasonable to assume that in a 4 week batch of individuals, some will respond same day, but others may not respond for 2 weeks or more.

Once your pool of “waiting response” emails in the wild is less than your weekly anticipated production run, a new batch of emails is sent out, to a number equal to the current 4 week anticipated production quantity.

If you produce units, then send emails to specific individuals for specific existing units, then you will generate a backlog of machines sitting in storage “Waiting on email response”

If you do not start production on units until email responses, you have the same storage pile up, just now of parts-not-yet-assembled instead of completed machines.

The method I outline has a production line that is constantly producing machines at maximum output rate, and minimizes the number of machines (or piles of parts) sitting in storage waiting on email responses. Enough slack is built in to always meet obligation (6 weeks), without having to ever set aside “untouchable” inventory.

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I received my Glowforge about 2 weeks after accepting the email. Totally surprised me and I was fully prepared to wait the 6 weeks stated.

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What was your original purchase date?

You mean his pre-purchase date? Different rules apply.

No new news.

We haven’t opened it up for submissions yet - right now, it’s still all Glowforge-made designs.

The shipping process can take up to 6 weeks.

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Yes but why not do that for a few days instead of 4 weeks? There is no shortage of people who will say yes within hours, so just keep emailing until you have enough for next day’s or next week’s dispatch. You still avoid stockpiling machines. The odd person might not reply straight away but you just put them back at the head of the queue when they do reply.

It is totally unreasonable to require people to be at home for a random six week period that you can only delay by 30 days. If you could delay your reply by up to six weeks it would make more sense.

Is there any other company in the world that does this and defines “shipping” in this way?

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No. But I’ve never had a company allow me to delay a shipment. If something is back ordered the only notification I get for items that require a signature is “we have just shipped your item”. Then you get a few days by the carrier to accept or it is shipped back.

So the devil is in both solutions.

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“No that $4K I put down 2 years ago, I was only doing that as a joke.”

I think one can assume that anyone who prepaid kinda wants it. :confused:

In the maker community, the words build and ship have very explicit different meanings, and the perversion of that meaning is not cool.

The saving grace of all of this is there is an actual product being shipped, albeit late and slowly.

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Just this past week someone was wondering on here whether or not they should cancel. That amount of money is tempting to want back in your pocket after so long. For some.

There are legitimate reasons to refuse the shipment. NRTL certification sticker probably being the one which will catch the most people. But for others, it may be that they are between lodging arrangements at present, or they really cannot work without the filter in any way at all, or even that they have no non-Enterprise Wifi available to connect to, so need to wait for that feature.

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I was reading through some of the discussion and something dawned on me as far as this “shipping” issue goes. One thing I had not considered, because I have taken issue with the language as well, is that Glowforge has said they aren’t touching anyones purchase money until the units ship. However, they are going to want that money once the production process on each unit begins. So, they ask one last time to make sure you still want it and once you say, “yes” then your money is taken out of the holding fund and placed into the production kitty. Maybe that’s why they’ve defined “shipping” the way they have, strange as that might be.

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Hopefully they would be solvent enough to cover what’s on the line. Perhaps you are correct.

When you order a MINI you put your money on the table, and you can then log in to the MINI lounge, and watch the changes in status, as it goes through the assembly line. They don’t have the webcams on the line anymore. But you know when the body is made, engine assembled, painted, and off the line. You can then track it on the container ship, and arrival into port. It’s not every step in production, but it’s much more clear than this.

If your scenario is correct, it would be nice to know. I’d still call “Shipping” the wrong term.

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Mmm, the concern I have is that if I took a couple of hours to answer the email asking if I was ready to receive my unit… and someone who ordered their unit later also got an email and answered it first are they now ahead in the line despite me placing the pre-order earlier simply because I was unable to answer the email immediately?